The virtue of excellence

Monday, June 21, 2010

MLK and Tiananmen Square

One of the key insights from van Creveld is that Morals and purpose wins the day...while simple force tends not to.  Now, my formalist friends will point me at China...but there is a bit of a problem.

There is no space between MLK winning his battle and Tiananmen Square.  If you leave Tiananment square, MLK wins.  If MLK loses, it's because of Tiananmen square.  Which is it to be?  Do you shoot MLK, or lock him in soviet-style gulag...or do you lose the moral battle?  Pick exactly one.

Power is nowhere near as simple as "who has the biggest guns", especially when the people with the guns are part of society.  Does anyone know how hard it is to get folks to shoot on their own people?  Even China had to replace its troops in Tiananmen square with troops from the provinces, and provide excessive lies to get the troops NOT to side with the students.  People side with their neighbors over the central government in any case short of the central government using torture.  North Korea is and Iraq was well past that spot.

2 comments:

Devin Finbarr said...

Was "van Creveld" cryogenically frozen for the course of the 20th century?

Ironically, the reactionary views Tienanmen as one of the few times in the 20th century when good won. The good side, for once, actually had the cojones to use force to put down a violent and criminal mob.

If you're interested in reading a reactionary counter to the ideas of van Creveld, check out Moldbug's been writing a bunch of comments in the last week on this blog that are worth reading.

Aretae said...

Ok. I thought that might be the view.

I stand opposed to the reactionary position. Against rich folks who live in the modern age, where people don't worry about whether there's going to be enough rice to avoid starvation...Rosa Parks wins. And Nelson Mandela, and Ghandi and MLK.

Against thugs with a near-starving population, Tiananmen square or the Soviet gulag happens.

In this author's view, the issue is entirely around the extent to which the citizenry no longer accepts "might makes right".

If, indeed, the reactionary wishes to return to the era where "might makes right" is the way of the world...I don't wish to go there with him. And if might doesn't make right, then the population stands with the dissident in LOTS of cases, and the monarch is constrained