Hugo Chavez came to power as the result of democratic elections. Democracy and party politics has continuously led to tyrants like Lenin, Hitler, Chavez, etc.I responded thusly:
I'm sure we have to tango about this whole Moldbug line of Democracy as the cause of Lenin.Perfidy then chimed in beginning:
Lenin was involved with the overthrow of the Monarchy, and the communists replaced a 8(?) month old democracy. Saying Lenin was a result of democracy is a convenient fiction. Lenin overthrew a monarch. Same as did Cromwell.
Hitler came out of a democracy that was guaranteed to fail via the peace of '21...which was a result of the war fought by Wilhelm I. Wilhelm fights war, destroys country, accepts impossible terms of reparations, and ... let's blame it on democracy?
Aretae, don't be to sure (heh) about the Lenin and Hitler. There's a couple lines of argument you can make regarding those two. [...lots of good stuff...]Here's the question. To what extent can Democracy be blamed for Hitler, Lenin, the evils of the 20th century? My read on history is that the problem is governments that have lots of power. Hitler was a result, as Perfidy says better than I did, of the onerous restrictions from the Treaty of Versailles. It had little to nothing to do with democracy. Similarly, Lenin was homegrown, and blaming his ascent on Democracy is a stretch...if you're being nice.
Rather, the problem is that over-powerful government is the scariest thing on the planet. The single thing joining all the horridness of the 20th century is over-strong governments: Mao's China, Soviet Russia, Nazi Germany, Khmer Rouge Cambodia...and the prior centuries weren't great either. 4000 years of Chinese stagnation (strong central government), French Revolution (strong central government), The Tsars (Were they better or worse than the communists?).
As a good Bayesian...I think it's hard to assign Democracy more than a 10% share of the blame.
50% I put on the shoulders of the doctrine of unlimited government, and
20% on the "Fatal Conceit" ... the idea that smart people/priests/academics can make large decisions that improve things without HUGE unintended consequences.
20% left for general I don't knows.